To all you lovely Journalists

[Deleted]

Hello all you lovely people, I have a question. Does it really matter if a degree in Journalism isn't accredited?

Thanks. Carl. x

[Sparkle]

Nah. Although it depends what job you're applying for.

[Deleted]

The degrees in Magazine Journalism and Feature Writing, which let's be honest, should really be a vocational course rather than an academic one, but never mind. It is at Southampton Solent though and I've heard less than brilliant reviews but as long as the course is ok I'll soldier through. Thanks!

[boxedjoy]

At a Christmas function, one of my lecturers made a comment along the lines of "as long as you have 100 wpm shorthand and a driving license you'll be sorted."

"Great"

[Sparkle]

I don't have shorthand, nor do I drive, and I have a decent career. I didn't do a journalism course (accredited or non-accredited) but I do now teach on both accredited and non-accredited degree courses.

[David]

SHORTHAND? Ha! I don't know a single journalist who has shorthand now. That's what digital recorders are for.

[Sparkle]

Old-school news reporters tend to still have fundamental shorthand skills, but even accredited courses are phasing out Teeline now.

[frapperia]

Really? I have lots of friends on courses or who have recently finished and they all seem to be learning Teeline! What is it being replaced with? Or are they just expecting that people use digital voice recorders?

Having said this, though I am a few years behind in my career compared to Sparkle, I've not got shorthand or any post-grad accreditation. It does hinder you in that it limits jobs you can go for, but it doesn't mean you can't work - experience is what they're looking for, more than an NCTJ.

[Cherubic]

Surely some moderate degree of talent for writing would be desirable?

[Sparkle]

cherubic said:

Surely some moderate degree of talent for writing would be desirable?

You're absolutely right. No editor really cares about experience. Being bright, sparky, full of ideas and keen to work is good, but nothing compares to someone who can submit interesting, well-written clean copy on time.

[boxedjoy]

Thank fuck for all this then.

My Teeline classes really annoy me. I like vowels.

[frapperia]

sparkle said:

cherubic said:

Surely some moderate degree of talent for writing would be desirable?

You're absolutely right. No editor really cares about experience. Being bright, sparky, full of ideas and keen to work is good, but nothing compares to someone who can submit interesting, well-written clean copy on time.

I have to beg to disagree. Of course all those things you mention are integral for being a good freelancer, but when it comes to being hired, someone with experience would surely be hired over someone without, and to imply that you can get a job without anything much on your CV so long as you're intelligent etc is a bit of a false impression.

While trawling job adverts on and off for the past few months, previous experience in the sector or medium is something that comes up time and time again in the text.

[Sparkle]

frapperia said:

I have to beg to disagree. Of course all those things you mention are integral for being a good freelancer, but when it comes to being hired, someone with experience would surely be hired over someone without, and to imply that you can get a job without anything much on your CV so long as you're intelligent etc is a bit of a false impression.

While trawling job adverts on and off for the past few months, previous experience in the sector or medium is something that comes up time and time again in the text.

How do you think you get experience? By being determined, intelligent, innovative, and using your initiative. If there aren't any jobs out there, make one. Get some transferable skills. See how you can make what experience you DO have into an asset for a potential employer.

As an aside, I've been hiring editorial assistants and junior writers recently, and the best ones so far have been the ones who genuinely wanted to work with us, had ideas about the direction of the magazine, could be trusted to work alone - not the ones who bragged about their internships on glossy mags. And incidentally, when we were shortlisting, the covering letters held more sway than the CVs.

[frapperia]

sparkle said:

frapperia said:

I have to beg to disagree. Of course all those things you mention are integral for being a good freelancer, but when it comes to being hired, someone with experience would surely be hired over someone without, and to imply that you can get a job without anything much on your CV so long as you're intelligent etc is a bit of a false impression.

While trawling job adverts on and off for the past few months, previous experience in the sector or medium is something that comes up time and time again in the text.

How do you think you get experience? By being determined, intelligent, innovative, and using your initiative. If there aren't any jobs out there, make one. Get some transferable skills. See how you can make what experience you DO have into an asset for a potential employer.

As an aside, I've been hiring editorial assistants and junior writers recently, and the best ones so far have been the ones who genuinely wanted to work with us, had ideas about the direction of the magazine, could be trusted to work alone - not the ones who bragged about their internships on glossy mags. And incidentally, when we were shortlisting, the covering letters held more sway than the CVs.

Thank you, I do know how you get experience, and that it's a good idea to spin whatever you do have positively.

Of course what you found in your best hires isn't just an obsession over experience and I'm glad for it for you. But not everyone's like that, many employers do like to know what you've done and what you got out of it.

Getting the experience in the first place is important, though. Why else do many of us slog away at the uni mag or radio at university and spend our holidays at newspapers and magazines - without those placements many people would struggle to get a job post-graduation with the millions of people who want to get into journalism.

I hope you found who you wanted and it's all working out well for you. Best of luck to you with the magazine.

And that's pretty much all I have to say on the matter, so I respectfully withdraw from the thread at this point.

[Sparkle]

frapperia said:

Thank you, I do know how you get experience, and that it's a good idea to spin whatever you do have positively.

Of course what you found in your best hires isn't just an obsession over experience and I'm glad for it for you, but getting the experience in the first place is important too! Why else do many of us slog away at the uni mag or radio at university and spend our holidays at newspapers and magazines - without those placements many people would struggle to get a job post-graduation with the millions of people who want to get into journalism.

I hope you found who you wanted and it's all working out well for you. Best of luck to you with the magazine.

And that's pretty much all I have to say on the matter, so I respectfully withdraw from the thread at this point.

OK, well, Frapperia is withdrawing from the thread, but just in case anyone else is interested in my thoughts on this matter - for what it's worth, I'm not saying that experience is entirely worthless, but it's only worthwhile if you've actually got any journalistic talent.

You don't need to work your fingers to the bone in student journalism, nor whore yourself around on unpaid internships for 18 months, if you've got something to offer an editor - on staff or freelance - and can make that clear. I'm not saying it's easy, but it can be done.

[Cherubic]

I was very interested. Thank you.

[ruth]

boxedjoy said:

At a Christmas function, one of my lecturers made a comment along the lines of "as long as you have 100 wpm shorthand and a driving license you'll be sorted."

"Great"

I would concur, though it depends what sort of journalism you want to do.

[David]

sparkle said:

cherubic said:

Surely some moderate degree of talent for writing would be desirable?

You're absolutely right. No editor really cares about experience. Being bright, sparky, full of ideas and keen to work is good, but nothing compares to someone who can submit interesting, well-written clean copy on time.

You'd be quite astounded (or not) at the amount of journalists out there who have none of those attributes.

Not including me, of course.

And for the record, I left a career in IT to become a journalist (doesn't it show). I have no qualifications in journalism, but do have good all-round experience and made sure I could back it up with 'interesting, well-written, clean copy'. Qualifications count for shit half the time, frankly, in quite a number of career paths.

[Deleted]

Thank you all, again. It looks like I'm going back to UClan in Preston now. Just have to get myself published again and impress the admissions tutor.